Conversation between Cauê Alves and Santídio Pereira
December 14, 2023, artist's studio, São Paulo, SP
Cauê Alves: Let's start talking about your memories. How did you become interested in art? Tell us a little about your background, your education and studies.
Santídio Pereira: Artistic activities appear in my life especially from the moment I arrived in São Paulo. Before that, I had a relationship with something that could be understood as art. But I wasn't aware that this could be understood as art. It was a beautiful thing, there in the Caatinga, where I was born. When it was raining a lot, a lot, in the Caatinga, in winter, when the floods flooded the lowlands, and the water almost touched the houses. When it rained a lot, I had a habit to stop it from raining: I would take a stick, draw a circle in the red earth, in the red clay, pull some lines and make an eye for the sun; It was sunny to stop raining and it was sunny. This, like, is the first drawing I made in my life, if I think about it. It's my first relationship with drawing.
IT: So you started drawing on dirt, before it was on paper?
SP: A drawing from life. I made a drawing because people said: “Make a sun eye, and the sun will come. And then it will stop raining.”
IT: And did it help?
SP: It stopped raining; It had already rained a lot, anyway, it was going to stop raining, but I was a child, so I really believed it was my sunshine. There must be a story about this, it's a custom there in the Northeast.
IT: When you arrived in São Paulo, was it easy to adapt? Where did you start your studies?
SP: As soon as I arrived from Piauí, my mother placed me in a place called Instituto Acaia, which is Elisa Bracher's NGO here in São Paulo. And it was at Acaia that I had my first contact with what I understand as artistic procedures. For example, when I was eight years old, I started doing carpentry. And, in the carpentry classes, as I missed Piauí, I missed my childhood memories, the carpentry classes with professor [Ênio] Alex helped me to have Piauí close to me, again.
I wanted to have a little horse close to me, which was in Piauí. And Alex taught me how to materialize this horse in wood. So, I drew a picture of a horse together with Alex, we cut it out and we had a horse. For me, the horse I used to ride when I was seven, eight years old in Acaia was as true as the horse I had left in Piauí, in such a way that it filled the longing I had for what I had left in Piauí. The carpentry started like this, to satisfy the longing, to put into the world what I was missing. So I, at eight years old, I think, managed to materialize a lot of memories.
Then I took drawing classes with Andressa. It was in such a way that I looked at a bottle, a plant, anything that was in front of me, except the human being, because I'm not good at portraits, nor was I. And I felt very happy. I stopped doing carpentry, I stopped doing everything and I became crazy about drawing. It was really satisfying, I was still a child.
Then there came a time when I realized that drawing didn't satisfy me as much as carpentry workshops. I didn't want to draw what was in front of me; I didn't want to draw what I came into contact with. I wanted to draw what I didn't have, what I lacked. I wanted to put into the world what I was missing, not what was close to me. The observation drawing did not account for this symbolic part of the drawing. There came a time when it started to make no sense to me. One day, Alex said to me: “Santídio, how about you visit another workshop? Come on, there’s a teacher called Fabrício Lopez, there’s the group Xiloceasa, come on, I’ll introduce you.”
I started taking engraving classes. I started just making xilo. So, yes, there I drew, I tried to draw from memory. I would make a drawing, record that drawing. When it printed, it was something else, but it was something satisfying. Something heavy, that had gravity for me. First you make a drawing, you engrave it, then you print it. There is a huge change from the beginning to the moment of printing. Its design changes, everything is inverted, the masses come in, the whites, the blacks, the result is very good. I liked making engravings, so I said: “I want to join the Xiloceasa group”, a group set up by Fabrício that had a certain prestige in the institution, they went to fairs, sold their engravings.
IT: What is your research process like? Do you draw, photograph what you are going to study?
SP: I take photos, draw, have ideas. I go to nature, that's where the idea is born. I think, “This is blue; this here is green; this way is like that.” That's where ideas are born. But I take photos, draw, sketch and so on. I started looking for plants a lot. I went to the Pantanal. At that time at MAM Panorama, I left Panorama and, on the same day, I went there near Minas, looking for plants. It was an artistic immersion with several wonderful artists. I went there to draw plants, draw bromeliads, I spent two weeks drawing plants, looking. Ah, the little frog inside the plant, the sun bromeliad, shade bromeliad, semi-shade bromeliad, bromeliad with inflorescence, ground bromeliad, epiphytic bromeliad, researching and having ideas. When I arrived here, I had several drawings. I took the notebook, it had several bromeliads, several hills, many landscapes, I think it's Bocaina, Serra da Bocaina. I was there, I was drawing and I saw that there were a lot of hills. I thought, “I think I want to make hills as well as plants.” I started drawing the hills, making the hills, researching hills. I went to Minas a few times, behind hills. Hills are born from plants, because I went looking for plants, and the hill showed itself to me. The hill chose me, I chose the hill.
IT: Then you changed the way you work with woodcuts.
SP: It's another way of making woodcuts, much easier. That way, I thought: “I’m just going to make the hills in the cutout”. I don't even record these hills; I draw a hill on the wood, take the jigsaw, then paint that piece, paint the other piece, paint all the pieces, put them together and print. So, it is no longer an engraving.
IT: Then, you started to expose the wood, the matrices became objects.
SP: When I started cutting, incising and fitting, I saw that the wood was no longer a matrix. When I started cutting, I saw that it had an object quality and, aware of this, I thought: “I'm going to make an object, so it won't be a matrix anymore, it will be an object that will be printed”. Then an awareness of an object that can be printed is born, which changes everything. Even the impression itself changes, based on object consciousness. The printed result changes. Then, I thought: “I’ll cut it out”. Creating these objects, I began to understand how I could install them on the wall, and this unfolded… And I've been doing this for about three or four years.